Red, Green & Blue: Is It Time to Just Live With Climate Change?
An article in this week’s Time magazine raises an interesting point about climate change. While there’s a growing consensus that global warming is real, the author writes, there’s also an emerging body of opinion that says it’s either too late to stop it or it’s not worth trying to stop. We’d be better off, these pundits say, investing in ways to make it easier to deal with the effects of climate change: build stronger dams, dikes and levees; do more to prevent the spread of diseases like malaria; provide more aid to help the poor live with increasingly hotter, or damper, or drier, or stormier conditions; etc.
While my initial reaction to people like Bjorn Lomborg, who has written, Cool It: The Skeptical Environmentalist’s Guide to Global Warming
Tags: Bjorn Lomborg, carbon emissions, climate change, Cool It, global warming, greenhouse gases, Red, Green and Blue
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November 1st, 2007 at 7:57 am
I’m reinstating yet another post that has vanished twice! Submitted by Max (not verified) on October 26, 2007 - 11:42pm. Hi Shirley, Sent this earlier but it apparently got removed from the site so am resending. You mention that Bjorn Lomborg was ill informed about polar bear population trends: “He argues, for example, that polar bears are actually thriving – all evidence to the contrary.” Did some checking of the “evidence”, and it turns out he may not be that far off, after all. The Polar Bear Study Group has published a summary of polar bear population status per 2005. http://pbsg.npolar.no/status-table14.htm This shows that of the 19 polar bear populations, 5 are declining, 7 are stable or increasing, and insufficient data are available for the other 7. Taken as a percentage of the total estimated polar bear population (estimated at 20,000-25,000): 20% of the population is declining 40% of the population is stable or increasing with insufficient data for the other 40%. Maybe not exactly “thriving” but looks like a majority of the polar bears are not doing too badly. Any comment? Regards, Max
November 1st, 2007 at 8:08 am
Oh! and here is another one of Max’s posts that vanished Submitted by Max (not verified) on October 25, 2007 - 1:14pm. Message to Shirley You wrote to Black Wallaby: “I suggest checking out these sites that might further address your question: “Research Finds That Earth’s Climate is Approaching ‘Dangerous’ Point.” RealClimate Gristmill’s “How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic” provides exhaustive information, including links to studies, addressing all sorts of climate change objections.” These sites (RealClimate and Gristmill) are obviously trying to defend the dogma of disastrous anthropogenic global warming against the scientific evidence that shows this dogma is a hoax. If you want to defend your standpoint, Shirley, come with some facts, not dogma. Regards, Max
November 1st, 2007 at 8:30 am
Hi Shirley, I notice that you are active elsewhere, but not here. You did respond to Max’s question on polar bears, but strangely that post vanished. There are several other questions of you that you remain silent on. (whilst busy elsewhere) Porque? Regards, BobFJ
November 1st, 2007 at 9:22 am
Hi Shirley, reur Oct 11, You wrote: "Consider the news from just this week: Tim Flannery (author of "The Weather Makers") said the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change report due out this November [2006 - one of several reports] will show that greenhouse gases had reached about 455 parts per million (in carbon dioxide equivalent) by the middle of 2005. That’s a level most scientists didn’t expect to see for another 10 years". You quote from a Reuters report of Oct 9 2007 which is LONG AFTER the several final IPCC 2007 reports, as if it was TODAY’s NEWS! Did you not notice that they quote Flannery’s Gotterdammerungen from BEFORE the publication of the said reports? Did it occur to you to check-out if Flannely was correct in his doomcast? Did you actually read the relevant sections of the various IPCC tomes, to see if they actually reflected his claims? AND, incidentally, messiah(s) James Hansen et al speak of a CO2 ALONE "Tipping Point" of 450 PPM, NOT this "CO2 Equivalent" even greater exaggeration of Flammery’s! LOL! Regards BobFJ
November 1st, 2007 at 11:39 am
To the "comfortable" out there,
I would like to reiterate with capatilized emphasis what Jimmy said above:
"THERE’s A LOT WE CAN DO IN THE WORLD WITH BASIC NUTRITION AND SANITATION THAT IS 1000 TIMES MORE EFFECTIVE…" (than CO2 reduction)
Do you selfish "comfortable people" not get-it yet?
Do you not know that there is a world of great suffering out there, way beyond your comfort zone?
LOL BobFJ
November 1st, 2007 at 11:54 am
Hello Richardbell,
Wherefore art thou?
Please, rather than you ASK US to research it, why don’t you give some examples of this slippery critter’s lies!
BobFJ
November 6th, 2007 at 8:08 am
Hi Shirley, Jeff McIntire-Strasburg and Max,
Max and I have become accustomed to our comment-posts dropping off this thread, and at least one of Shirley’s, (Max thinks two), but why is my:
BobFJ Says: October 27th, 2007 at 10:49 pm
crossed-out as we put it in British/Oz English, which I think = Struck-through in Americano? As far as I can tell, there is no editorial policy reason for this to happen.
Hey Jeff, take your time, I realize that you are up-to-the-eyebrows in stuff at the moment, take your time, but Shirley, you would seem to have plenty of time if you can clarify the situation.
Regards, (identity crisis) BobFJ/Black Wallaby
November 8th, 2007 at 9:57 pm
The trouble is, even if we end up being too late to protect people from climate change, and are forced to adopt the kind of plan you are talking about, we are still facing a dwindling of the natural resources vs. a booming of the population.
Climate change or no climate change, the technology needs to evolve, and we need to buy ourselves as much time to make that happen as possible, or we’ll all in for some serious changes.
January 31st, 2008 at 4:31 pm
Hi all,
Thanks for all your comments, and sorry it’s been so long since I’ve checked in on this discussion.
Let me start by saying I agree with many of the things that have been said re: climate change, resources, basic nutrition, comfort, etc. Yes, we in the developed world consume more than our share of resources and, yes, we should do more to conserve and improve efficiency … climate change or no. Yes, also, doing more to provide the world’s most disadvantaged with basic food, clean water and reliable energy would be the right thing to do … again, climate change or no.
However, I think the volume of evidence from multiple sources around the globe makes it very clear that something very real — and concerning — is happening to our climate (and, as a result, our ecosystems, both on land and in the oceans). Every day, new research also points to a new potential tipping point that no one had recognized before. Clearly, the Earth is a finely balanced system with myriad elements needed to make it work.
(For great insights into this, I highly recommend James Lovelock’s latest book, “The Revenge of Gaia: Earth’s Climate Crisis & the Fate of Humanity.” It’s also worth noting that Lovelock — a brilliant guy with the career to prove it — did not himself believe climate change was real or worrisome until he sat down with the scientists studying the issue and reviewed the data himself.)
Anyway, I’ll close here with a few links to some recent (past three months) studies and reports that address some of the issues that have been raised here:
2007 was Tenth Warmest for U.S., Fifth Warmest Worldwide
New Science Paper Says Carbon Emissions Threaten Coral Reefs
50th Anniversary of the Global Carbon Dioxide Record
Symposium and Celebration
Arctic Sea Ice Shatters All Previous Record Lows
What has been happening to polar bears in recent decades?
Man-Made Changes Bring About New Epoch in Earth’s History: Geologists claim old epoch has ended
New Report Shows Climate Change Faster Than Predicted: A new report for The Climate institute shows that the window of opportunity for a smooth transition to a low carbon, clean energy economy is closing faster than many have predicted.